This Was My Wakeup Call with Stephan Spencer

In this Episode

• [00:17] Stephan shares his interview on My Wakeup Call with Dr. Mark Goulston as he talks about his spiritual awakening journey, which opened up a lot of blessings in his life.
• [01:15] Mark starts his show by introducing Stephan as one of the world’s leading SEO experts, best-selling author, and founder of an agency called Netconcepts.
• [03:46] Stephan narrates his journey from being agnostic for 42 years to witnessing and surrendering to life’s wake-up calls and big spiritual awakenings.
• [10:19] Stephan recalls a moment that saved his family member’s life and made him very spiritual and connected.
• [19:30] Mark asks Stephan’s thoughts about the things that fuel and sustain skepticism and cynicism.
• [21:54] Mark communicates having empathic abilities and shares his book Just Listen, which is about the power of causing another person to feel felt by you versus just feeling understood.
• [24:27] Stephan discusses the importance of the idea of surrender and gives an example where he surrendered, and magic happened.
• [34:50] Mark wants Stephan to crystallize what his soul mission is.
• [36:29] Mark and Stephan discuss intuitive hits that give Mark an idea to address his sleep issue.
• [44:37] Stephan communicates to the listeners that the best way to connect with him is through his website and his two podcasts: Get Yourself Optimized and Marketing Speak.
• [45:28] Mark thanks Stephan for being on his show and sharing his journey.

Jump to Links and Resources

Welcome to another episode of My Wakeup Call. The introduction is new to my guest but is not new to you, my listeners. This is for the benefit of my guest not for you listeners because if you’ve listened to these episodes, you know I start them always the same way. 

I meet people in the world, I get to know them a little bit, and I want to get to know them even more. More than that, I want to have the process of getting to know them be something that you, my listeners, can witness and share in because these are special people. These are people that make the world better. These are the people who are up to all good and they’re fighting a tough battle against the people in the world who are up to no good.

This person is not new to me. He may be new to you, but I’ve known Stephan Spencer for some years. We actually met years ago back in the East. I think we attended a New York Yankee game. We both attended some sort of weekend thing and it was wonderful. Then Stephan moved to California and since then he’s moved around. Let me tell you a little bit about him.

He’s a deeply thoughtful spiritual person. You might not get that from what I’m about to tell you about him because he’s one of the world’s leading SEO experts. He’s the founder of an agency called Netconcepts. He’s a best selling author. He has three books published by O’Reilly, The Art of SEO, Social eCommerce, and Google Power Search. They’re like Bibles. 

If you want a resource, you check out those books. He’s optimized the websites of some of the biggest brands in the world, including Chanel, Volvo, Sony, and Zappos, and he hosts two podcasts called Getting Yourself Optimized—I was one of his earlier guests—and Marketing Speak. He joins us now from Miami. Stephan, it’s great to see you.

It’s such a joy to see you.

I really feel that I’m looking into his eyes over my DSL camera and I’m just feeling the history that we’ve had. We’ve gone on some hikes before when he lived in California. He’s had quite a personal journey in his life, but I want him to tell you about that. If I were to ask you, what’s the throughline in you, in your life, in terms of purpose calling, why do you think you’re here? Then share with us if there’s an origin story or wake up calls. I’m just going to listen and nudge you a little bit here and there but take it away.

I’ll tell you the throughline was not immediately evident to me. When I was 42, I went to India on a Tony Robbins Platinum Partner trip and I got touched on a head by a monk. That’s called a Deeksha, a oneness blessing, and it was like an LSD trip. Not that I’ve done any drugs because I haven’t but everything was in technicolor. I was in this deep sense of knowing bliss, connection. 

Prior to that, for my first 42 years of life, I didn’t even believe in God. I wasn’t completely atheistic, I was agnostic. I wouldn’t say that I was completely lost, but it was a surprise to me to realize that I had been guided and protected the whole way. Even when I was not feeling connected to the Creator, to my higher power, my purpose, I just was kind of going through things blind. 

I didn't want a near-death experience to get a job, but I wanted the job. I wanted to have that purpose, that mission directly given to me by the Creator. Share on X

I walked away without a scratch from some really harrowing things like a car crash where I fell asleep behind the wheel going 65 miles an hour, driving all night. It was seven hours into an eight-hour drive and I went off the road, and spun out into a ditch. Before I did, I hit a lamppost on the freeway, and luckily it was one of those kinds that popped out, but it wasn’t luck. 

Also, it wasn’t luck that I walked away without a scratch and the car got totaled, kind of crushed around me. I didn’t realize until my second big spiritual awakening, which just happened this year—which I’m happy to go into—that the angels had wrapped me around with this geodesic dome of energy to protect me so that I wouldn’t get crushed by the metal. I walked away without a scratch. 

The trooper who came to report on the damage and everything was amazed. He said, “You’re a very lucky man.” At the time, I thought it was luck or I thought it was just good fortune. I did not realize the intervention that happened at that moment. There are so many instances of that in my life, I was just clueless. 

I thought it was luck or just good fortune. I did not realize the intervention that happened at that moment.

I can’t say that I had this throughline except for I felt like I needed and wanted to make a difference in the world, especially in the area of medicine. I went to school studying for a bachelor’s degree in molecular and cellular biology. Then a master’s in biochemistry. I was actually studying for a Ph.D., but I ended up dropping out. 

The reason why is because I had a run-in with my advisor and he wanted me at the bench all the time, it didn’t matter that I had young children and a family. We kind of were at odds in that regard. Also, I went to a conference just a few months earlier that Tim Berners Lee spoke at, the inventor of the World Wide Web. I met one of the guys from Netscape even before anybody heard of Netscape—this was 1994—and I was enamored by it all, so I decided to drop out and start an internet company back in 1995. 

It was an interesting journey. Up until that point, I thought my path was set. I’m going to become a professor, I’m going to do research, I’m going to help cure cancer or whatever the disease is, but I’m going to make a big difference. There’s this part of me that felt like I gave up on something important by making that shift.

In reality, now that I see the bit of the bigger picture, I know that it wasn’t meant to be that way. It was meant to be the way that it completely unfolded was perfect. At the time, it felt like I was kind of selling out, going after the money and it wasn’t that way, but that’s how it felt. 

There’s this term called Comparative Success Syndrome that I learned about when I was interviewing Elissa Fisher Harris for my podcast Get Yourself Optimized. She told me a lot about impostor syndrome, which I thought okay, I have that. She also told me about something called Comparative Success Syndrome, which is a close cousin. That is about the person you could have been if you’d made some different choices. 

I thought, maybe I should have continued with my studies, become a professor, done all the research, gotten grant money, and eked out a living because most professors make very little money, but it wasn’t meant to be and I’m very grateful for the way everything unfolded. It was perfect. It was divine. It was divinely guided. 

I’m a heartfelt connected guy, and I am receiving miracles a lot.

You asked what were some of these big moments that woke me up, that moment in October of 2012 where I got touched on the head by this oneness monk was certainly one of them. Then there was one that just happened this year in January and I already consider myself very spiritual and connected. I’ve been studying Kabbalah for six years, I’ve been doing oneness. I’m a pretty heartfelt connected guy and I am receiving miracles a lot, just honest to God miracles, real miracles.

Can you share what happened? I think you mentioned it a couple of times in the last year. There was another of these wake-up moments.

It was on January 22. I prayed to God for a job and that might sound a little strange since I have a successful business. We’re doing SEO for brands big and small. We’re a good seven-figure business and I’m very, very good at it. I’m world-class. That’s not why I’m on this planet and I didn’t understand what it was that I was here for, but I knew it wasn’t just to get people’s websites to the top of Google.

I interviewed a few months prior to this a psychic medium, somebody who’s absolutely legitimate, very heartfelt, wonderful person, her name is Sheila Gillette. I interviewed her and in my preparations for this interview, I watched a video where she described her near-death experience. It was just after childbirth and she had an embolism. She was on her deathbed. She was definitely going to be gone probably within hours, but she prayed. She prayed to God for a job. She said, please, God, let me stay on this planet. Let me raise my kids, please just give me a job, I’ll do anything, give me a job. 

We co-create with the Creator; I had no idea about this. It changed everything, and then I started getting all these messages, and I started getting psychic abilities. Share on X

It took a few months, but three months or so later, I decided I’m going to pray for a job. I didn’t want a near-death experience in order to get a job, but I wanted the job. I wanted to have that purpose, that mission that was directly given to me by the Creator. 

It was instant, it was like the veils had been peeled away and I could see the matrix. I could see how my life had been saved by angels when I had that car crash in my early 20s. I could see how this is more like a simulation, more like a movie that I’m the director of, that I’m the pilot in the cockpit of my own airplane. 

This is my own universe in the multiverse. I get to call the shots to a much larger degree than I ever thought possible. This is called co-creation. We co-create with the Creator, I had no idea about this. It just changed everything for me. It changed everything and then I started getting all these messages and I started getting psychic abilities. 

This is my own universe in the multiverse. I get to call the shots to a much larger degree than I ever thought possible.

If you were to ask me or even just told me about psychic phenomenon and you have this capability yourself. About 14 months ago, I would have told you that’s nonsense. No way. I don’t believe it. I wouldn’t dismiss it out of hand like that. I do believe in the willing suspension of disbelief. I would not just take it on board as truth. 

Now I feel completely different about it because I’ve had the experience of receiving messages and having those kinds of clairaudience, clairvoyance, visions, prophetic dreams, all that sort of stuff that sounds fantastical and I’m a science guy. Remember, I was a biochemist and now I’m an internet nerd who built companies and sold companies. 

I am not normally seen as somebody who’s pretty woo woo, but I’m not seen as somebody who’s also a complete skeptic either. I see skepticism and cynicism as two sides of the same coin and I don’t want to be a cynic. I don’t know anyone who wants to be a cynic and skepticism is so close. I do believe in the willing suspension of disbelief.

I’ll tell you what happened that was an additional wake up call for me that started this whole trajectory into the January 22nd prayer and the answer that came. I had a guest on my podcast who is a psychic medium, and I had only had one other guest prior to that who was psychic, Paul Selig or that was a medium I should say. I did have somebody else who was psychic for a few years prior.

Anyway, Paul Selig, he’s pretty famous, and I really enjoyed interviewing him. That was really really cool. He even channeled in the episode. I met in METal, which is a group that we’re both in, a guy whose name is Mark Nelson, who introduced himself in a Zoom breakout room on one of the Saturday meetings as an ad guy who writes copy and oh, by the way, I’m also a medium. My ears perked and I’m like, what?

For my first 42 years of life, I didn't even believe in God. I wasn't completely atheistic; I was agnostic. Share on X

This was about 15 months ago. I’m really intrigued and I don’t know what it was, but I felt compelled to have him on my podcast right away, and thank goodness I did because he saved my family member’s life while I was interviewing him.

What happened was I cleared the deck, no interviews scheduled for a three-week time period while I was getting ready to move from LA down to Florida. I squeezed him and I figured I needed to have him on. I don’t know why, but it was like an intuitive hit. At that very time slot where I interviewed him, a family member was having a stroke at that moment and didn’t believe it and wasn’t going to the hospital.

When my wife, Orion, slipped a note to me in the middle of the interview asking if this person is having a stroke and I interrupted the interview to ask him this. He said, yes, absolutely she is and here’s what’s going to happen. Here’s what it looks like if she doesn’t go to the hospital. It was dire, it was not good.

She was going to lose a lot of functionality. It was not good. She’s doing great now. She did go to the hospital. It took begging and pleading, but we wouldn’t have been so forceful about it. She lived very far away so we couldn’t drive, pick her up, and take her. We had to convince her over the phone and we did. It wouldn’t happen if I hadn’t interviewed Mark Nelson. 

Mark Nelson is a very famous medium. I did not know how famous until I looked them up online in preparation for the interview. There’s a TV show on The Gifted where 700 psychics were interviewed by the TV show and of those 700, I think 10 or 12 were selected to be on the show. Mark was one of those and they just threw the hardest challenges to these folks and he ended up winning. He was the number one most gifted.

I remember watching this little segment of him where he was on the show and there were three similar-aged people sitting in front of him. He knew nothing about them and he was able to discern immediately that they went to school together. He started receiving information about them. He saw visions of them at a high school. There are desks but there aren’t boots. People were then hiding under desks and he immediately realized this was Columbine. You all three went to Columbine. 

Then he started describing how they escaped. You went out the back door. You were hiding in the library. The only thing he got wrong, which is just a minor thing, he said you were hiding in the library to one of them. That person was actually hiding under the library. Everything else was spot on. This guy is the real deal. 

That opened the door to me believing in psychic phenomena because I’d never had any interest in getting a reading, going into a seance, nothing like that. It wasn’t until he saved my family member’s life that I realized this was not an accident. I’ve always heard Tony Robbins talk about there are no coincidences, because I’ve been to a lot of Tony Robbins events, and that was clearly not a coincidence. Lots of wake up calls. 

What do you think fuels and sustain skepticism and cynicism?

Once we get disconnected, then it’s easy to stay disconnected. I don’t know what it was that started the disconnection in me other than the frustration with my grandparents who are raising me one was a Jehovah’s Witness and the other was a converted Catholic. They were at odds about everything. I just thought, this whole thing is bunk. That’s probably what really started it, but then it’s so easy to stay on that track and it’s equally as easy to get off from it too. 

If you want to more than believe, as the monks in India explained to me, the Divine is an experience, not a belief. If you want to experience the Divine, then you got to put yourself out there. You have to have that willing suspension of disbelief and try some things whether it’s ayahuasca. I’ve never done any of that. I’m not pooh-poohing it by any stretch. I’m just saying that wasn’t my path.

I didn’t choose that path, but it could be for you, the listener, plant medicine. It could be a 10- or 12-day silence meditation retreat, Vipassana is what it’s called. It could be that you go to a Tony Robbins event or some other—guru isn’t the right word, but somebody who is more along the path spiritually so that you can kind of catch up. 

Whatever the path that you choose, take some action.

Whatever the path is that you choose, take some action. Yes, we’re co-creators with the Creator, but if you just wish it without action is incomplete. You don’t close the circuit. It’s like a bridge that’s most of the way built, you can’t send a single car over a 95% built bridge. 

I have some empathic abilities. Sometimes when my empathy is accurate and people feel felt, one of my books Just Listen is about really the power of causing another person to feel felt by you versus just feeling understood. Feeling understood is better than feeling misunderstood, but there’s still a gap. There’s still an experiential gap when you understand someone compared to when they feel felt by you. 

One of my challenges is I think when people feel understood and feel felt by me, a number of them lean towards me. Some people will say, I can’t hide from you. I will say, is that a good thing? They say, it’s a weird thing. I don’t think it’s bad, but it’s weird. I hope you never stop what it is that we do because I hide from everyone, including myself. 

I share that with you because I guess people feel a certain safety with me that allows them to surrender to the experience. I may do it because I vicariously live through them surrendering into the experience of feeling felt by me, but I have trouble surrendering myself. I’m not a control freak and there’s a part of me that just aches to surrender. I have lots of difficulties falling asleep. At night, my mind will be racing and I am exhausted. My body is ready to fall asleep, but my mind is on its own track. 

It happens almost nightly where I would just like to be able to surrender and have my mind rest and collapse with where my body is already done for the day. I’m really listening in to what you’re saying and resonating with it. Part of my interest is to go from an analytic frame into really feeling the spirituality, embracing it, surrendering to it, and allowing it in versus I’m not sure that I’m a skeptic or a cynic, but I would love to allow it in.

You can, I think it’s right there for you. I think you’re ready for it. This idea of surrender is really important. It’s really, really important. I want to give you an example of a situation where I surrendered and then that’s where the magic happened. I was divorced in 2009 and I went through a really rough patch where three different people saw how wrecked I was and decided that I needed to go to a Tony Robbins event. I was not really that keen on it. I didn’t really know anything about Tony Robbins other than he was on TV with his infomercials. 

It wasn’t my thing, but three different people, all within a very short time span, are telling me to go to this Tony Robbins event which was called Unleash the Power Within felt like I was supposed to do that. I did and it started again. It was a big wake up call. 

I'm very grateful for the way everything unfolded. It was perfect. It was divine. It was divinely guided. Share on X

I walked on to third degree hot coals and my bare feet. I never thought I would do that in my life or anything like that. Never thought I’d break a board or break an arrow with my throat or any of this sort of stuff that I’ve done since. This one moment was a catalyst for a whole lot of changes because I realized after walking on those coals and not burning—in fact not even getting a blister that—I could do anything. 

I could go get a hair transplant, which I did. Three months later, I got a hair transplant. I could go get Lasik. I’ve been wearing glasses for decades. Three weeks later, I was in the doctor’s office getting Lasik, no more glasses.

All these changes that were from the outside perspective, external changes, actually, we’re just a reflection of the massive internal changes. I was a different person. When I went through all this transformation over the next 10 months, nobody recognized me when I would start showing up at conferences again after the hair grew in, all the stuff that I had gone through, the changes I’d made, the diet changes, and exercise changes.

All these changes from the outside perspective — external changes actually — are just a reflection of the massive internal changes.

People literally did not recognize me. That was really exciting and fun for a little while. Of course, that was a long time ago now. That was in 2010. But that idea of surrendering came too ahead when I realized that I needed some help to kind of learn some skills around pickup because I had gone two and a half years without a single date.

I went and joined a mastermind called The Society, which is a secret society. Not so secret because it has a website, but a secret society run by Neil Strauss. Neil Strauss is famous for his book, The Game, all about the underground world of pickup artists. He was a very successful pickup artist.

I learned pick up from him and from other people that he brought in to teach at these intensives because I was part of this mastermind. There were 50 of us at the time and then it grew up to 100. I’ve been in this for years. I ended up being a personal development mastermind really, not a pickup mastermind, but I did learn a lot of pick ups.

It was through the act of surrendering that everything sped up and I met my soulmate almost instantaneously. I was at a Tony Robbins event. I was at Date With Destiny. It was the very last day. I was working on my poster board, which had all the power virtues, my mission statements towards values, away from values, and most importantly, my relationship vision.

That relationship vision, I wrote in a very connected state. I was writing all the attributes of who she was going to be. Then I wrote who I was going to be, how I would show up in the relationship, what the relationship would be like. It was beautiful. And then I prayed.

I prayed for her to show up right away. I was very specific about it right away. Twelve hours later, we were introduced by a mutual friend. I knew in five minutes that she was the one. The way I knew it was because remember that Deeksha, that oneness blessing that I got touched by a monk with? In that same trip in India, two months prior to this Date With Destiny event, I had also learned how to give these blessings. I was a Deeksha giver, too.

That last night of the event, almost everyone had gotten the Deeksha, but not her. She didn’t get touched. She was kind of bummed about it and like, I know how to do that. I can give you a Deeksha. We just met. She said, I would love that.

I prayed for her like she was my soul mate, and I knew.

I prayed for her. I put my hands on her head and prayed for her that divine grace would flow through me to her and so much so that I knew she was the one because the more you pray for somebody, the more divine grace flows through to them. I prayed for her like she was my soulmate and I knew.

It was very short before I already had a ring. Nine days later, I surprised her with a proposal in a hot air balloon above the Las Vegas desert. She said no. She said more precisely, not yet. That made sense, logically speaking, because it had only been nine days.

On the positive side, it was a very powerful moment for us that brought us even closer together, even though it was a very painful and awkward 20-minute descent back down to earth, literally. I remember how shocked the pilot was because he had taken video for me with my iPhone. He told me beforehand he’s never had a failed proposal, so I killed a streak.

Nine months later, I re-proposed to her and she said, yes. But the surrender part is where I said, I am not going to use my techniques, which I could be pretty successful with. I’m a little embarrassed to say I was successful with it just the night before I met my wife. It’s not about the skills, it’s not about your abilities.

Life happens for us, not to us.

It’s not about being in a flow state or whatever. It’s about surrendering more than anything, because if we just allow the Creator to work through us, for all the synchronicities, and all the divine timing, everything that happens for us because life happens for us, not to us, as Tony Robbins says. I’m sure others have said that prior to him.

There’s another level to that. I’ve learned this recently from Neil Canon, a mutual friend in METal. That is, yes, life happens for us, not just to us, but there’s another level where life happens by us. That’s where that co-creation comes in.

Just the other day, I’m like, I need to mail this FedEx package. I would just love to not have to figure out a drop-off location and all that. I would just love for a FedEx truck to appear right on the way, a half-mile away from where I’m dropping my mother-in-law at the ACC for her class.

Boom, within a minute, there was a FedEx truck right in the middle of the road in between lanes, between the two different directions, parked with the guy in the back, messing around with whatever his packages were. All I had to do was slow down, hand him the package, and I’m off. I didn’t even have to go a millimeter out of my way.

That’s just a small example, but we have so much more power than we could possibly imagine, each of us. We are the co-creator of not just our little world around us, our neighborhood, our family, or our sphere of what we think has influenced us.

We have a global effect. If we believe that World War III is coming, we can bring it on, just by our beliefs in our universe, in our little slice of the multiverse. That’s maybe scary for some, but it’s also very empowering because with great power comes great responsibility and also great blessings.

To our listeners, to circle back, tell me if I’m getting this one. When Stephan mentioned that he wanted a job, I think what you were saying is you wanted an assignment. Not like go get a job at a company, but you wanted a job from that higher power, that being. Give me something that is aligned with why I’m here.

Yeah, my soul mission.

Before we bring this to a close, can you crystallize what that mission is?

An ambassador of spirituality. That’s the short of it. I’m working on a self-help book that I’m intuiting. Channeling intuition is not a gut feeling. To some it is, but it’s so much more than that. It’s the angelic realm whispering into our consciousness.

Channeling intuition is not a gut feeling.

If we listen to our intuition and then act on it, beautiful, magical things are going to happen in our life. An intuitive hit is something that comes unexpectedly. It comes in charged neutral. There’s no emotion to it. It’s not fear-inducing or anxiety-producing, it just simply is.

Finally, it doesn’t lead anywhere else. It doesn’t jump to the next thought, to the next thought, to the next thought. Then the next thing you know, you remember, oh, yeah, I need to pick up milk at the store. It just stays there. Those are the intuitive hits. Pay attention to those.

Even if you don’t feel very spiritually inclined or connected, just pay attention to your intuition. I have a feeling, Mark, that you have an intuitive hit around what to do about your sleep issue. Putting aside all of the knowledge, analysis, and all the left brain logical stuff that you have looked at in regards to sleep, what is an intuitive hit that tells you that I should do this about my sleep?

Here’s something. My dad died at 95, I think. He could be a little bit on the critical side. I have older brothers. I have a middle brother. I’m the youngest, who could be the recipient of that. He was a numbers person. He trained as an accountant.

Even if you don’t feel very spiritually inclined or connected, pay attention to your intuition.

It’s interesting you’re bringing this up because here’s the intuitive hit. I think I had trouble falling asleep all the way back in my childhood. I think there was one night, my guess is I was seven or eight, in which I was kind of moaning with feeling frustrated. I was tired and I couldn’t get to sleep.

This was so unlike my father. He comes into the room. I think I was even crying. I can’t stand it, I can’t fall asleep, or whatever. Then he said to me, I think it’s possible to rest with your eyes open. He said, if you fall asleep, that’s okay. But even if you don’t fall asleep, nighttime is a time to rest so you can face the next day. And I think even if your eyes don’t close, it’s still possible to rest.

That was something that is so out of character from an accountant, analytical mind. But every now and then, when I think of those special moments of kindness and understanding as opposed to criticism, that’s probably one of a handful of moments of just his being kind. What you just said, help me to remember that. I’m going to try that tonight.

That’s awesome. I think you could try that one, not should. Because “should,” according to Marshall, I think was his name, the founder of NVC, Nonviolent Communication, “should” is the most violent word in the human language.

I will do it, yeah. Is it Marshall Rosenberg?

Rosenberg. Yeah, that’s right. He definitely changed my thinking around the word should. Let me rephrase it to say, I highly recommend that you try that not just for a night, but for a week. I think it will take the pressure off.

That’s a form of surrender right there. Just being okay with whatever happens next.

I need to sleep. If I need to sleep, I’m going to take it, and let’s see how long it goes. Fifteen minutes or whatever, I would just be in a contemplative state or in a rest state with my eyes open. My eyes closed, my eyes closed. That’s a form of surrender right there. Just being okay with whatever happens next.

I do think that that was an intuitive hit for your dad to say that. I do think that everything happens for a reason. There’s nothing random. The fact that you brought up your dad right now is significant.

Every malady, syndrome, disease, disorder, every physical manifestation of discomfort comes from interference from an external source like an entity, a negative entity, or negative thought-form, or something that is messing with you. You are in a low vibration. Thus, you are receptive or vulnerable to infiltration by that negative entity or whatever the thing is that’s interfering with you. Something that manifests as a disease could have had an origin point decades earlier.

I’ve been learning from Tina Zion. She’s a famous medical intuitive. Medical intuition is where you can intuit things that are wrong with people’s physical body and also with their energetic bodies. I’m learning from her and I’m learning all these concepts. The thing I just described to you, I learned from her that it has an interference source.

It’s not just you’re outside and you happen to get rays of sunshine that just, by chance, break the DNA at exactly the wrong point where it messes with a gene for programmed cell death and the next thing you know, you got cancer. No. Some entity that interfered with you made that happen. Nothing’s by random chance.

If you think about your relationship with your dad and if there’s healing to be had there, if there is forgiveness, if there is torment, you can always tell if there’s torment for a person that there is a blockage of unforgiveness that needs to be released. I don’t know where you’re at with your relationship with your dad.

This can be healed if it’s not whole and complete now. It doesn’t matter how long ago he passed. It can be healed now. Things that have a physical manifestation that seem completely unrelated to anything, once you start digging in, it can have a very important emotional connection to somebody that hurt us in our childhood.

For example, Morton’s neuroma on my left index finger bothered me for seven years. I had no way to fix it. I tried a lot of different modalities with doctors, with allopathic medicine, nothing. No benefit.

I found that there was a connection to my grandfather who was physically abusive when I was growing up. I had to live with him for a number of years. I didn’t remember this, but he had hurt me when I was 12. He hurt my finger. Maybe I was 10. I was around that age. That seeded the cascade that then turned into more trauma decades later.

By forgiving him. I released a lot of unforgiveness, resentment, dis-ease. Not disease like disease, but dis-ease in my soul because I harbored that resentment. Even though I worked on this and I thought I was through it, I wasn’t. It took the Morton’s neuroma to wake me up to this.

I had this beautiful healing. It’s been a lot better. It’s not as painful. It’s not completely gone yet, but it is much better. I have this deep connection with my grandfather now that I didn’t have two months earlier because of the Morton’s neuroma.

I’m like, okay, I got to get to the bottom of this. There it was, my grandfather was at the bottom of it. It wasn’t some cellular thing going on. Yes, there is a physical manifestation of it that is absolutely at the biochemical and biophysical level, but there’s something even deeper. It’s emotional and spiritual. I bet that’s going on with you and your dad.

Yeah, I can feel you’re right. Thank you for being on and taking us on this journey. The journey continues. It’s been a real treat for me. I know it’s been a treat and a gift to our listeners. Where can people best find you and get in touch with you?

Yeah, stephanspencer.com is my main website. My podcasts are Get Yourself Optimized, so that’s getyourselfoptimized.com for that website, and Marketing Speak, which is all things marketing, especially SEO, Facebook, ecommerce, analytics, and all that sort of stuff. That’s marketingspeak.com. If folks want to email me directly, they can email me at me@stephanspencer.com.

Great. Thank you, my good friend. It’s so good to see you. It’s so good to hear these things that I hadn’t heard before, especially, I’m taking in and I’m feeling in some of the suggestions or what was the way you phrased it? It wasn’t a should.

The Divine is an experience, not a belief. If you want to experience the Divine, you have to put yourself out there. Share on X

Just a recommendation. You’re welcome to use what works and discard the rest. 

That’s great. Thank you. Thank you to our listeners for listening to another episode of My Wakeup Call. It helps if you leave reviews or comments on Apple podcasts on how we can do a better job.

If there are guests that you think of that you’d like to hear or see being on the show, please connect with us. Until next time. When wake up calls come your way, don’t beat up on yourself.

You can miss a few buses, but the bus will keep coming. One of these days, you will wake up to a wake up call and it will help you pivot your life, maybe even change your life. Until next time, thanks again for tuning in. Be well. Take care of those you love, including yourself. Bye-bye.

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